10 days Luzern, Montreux, Wengen in October

10 days Luzern, Montreux, Wengen in October

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Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 11, 2018 - 8:41 PM

Hi, we are a couple visiting Switzerland on 1st October 2018, for a 11 days trip. We have been following this forum for the last couple of weeks. The amount of organized information we have got from here has helped us a lot in preparing the below itenerary based on our preferences which include easy hikes, scenic train / boat trips and small village visits.

Base - Luzern :

Day 1 : Reach Zurich in the evening and take train to Luzern.

Day 2 - Trip to Mount Titlis , Visit Old town , Chapel bridge

Day 3 - Trip to Mount Rigi (Boat trip to Vitznau – Go to Rigi Kulm by Cogwheel train – Hike to Rigi kaltbad - Take cable car to Weggis – Spend some time in Weggis - Take boat back to Luzern)

- Is a short visit to Bern possible after returning from Mount Rigi ?

Day 4 - Luzern - Brig (Board Glacier express) - Chur - Back to Luzern

Base - Montreux :

Day 5 - Take Golden Pass from Luzern to Montreux - Visit Vevey - Hike in Lavaux vineyards (Epesses - Chexbres - Rivaz - Saint Saphorin) - Overnight in Montreux

- Is seat reservation needed from Lucerne to Montreux in the Golden Pass route ?

Day 6 - Visit Château de Chillon. Travel to Wengen/Lauterbrunnen.

- Can we include any other activities on this day (like boat ride around interlaken or short hikes nearby) if we reach in the afternoon ?

Base - Wengen / Lauterbrunnen / Wilderswil

Day 7 - Schilthorn trip - Walk around Murren - Gimmelwald .

Day 8 - Scenic boat ride (Lake Thun or Lake Brienz) with any lakeside town visit

Day 9 - Day trip to Zermatt (Gornergrat) - Rotenboden to Rifflealp hike

Day 10 - Mannlichen to Klein Scheidegg hike

Day 11 - Return to Zurich (probably visit Rhine falls) and take flight back early morning next day.

- Based on our travel plans, which one (Lauterbrunnen/Wengen or Wilderswil ) would be a better base from Day 7 - Day 10 ?

- Is it feasible to include the First-Bachalpsee trial in any of the above days ?

- How does the overall itenerary look ? Since in October the temperature may decrease as the days pass, will it make any sense if we make our first base as Wengen/Lauterbrunnen and then move to Lucerne. Any modifications for a better experience will be great.

Thanks !

Magicden
Magicden
21 posts
new member
Jul 11, 2018 - 10:25 PM

Looks great we are here just now, try to do Schilthorn when in Wengen, Lauterbrunnen area, Trummelbach falls also great, castle Chillon very nice especially if as part of boat trip. Gornergrat good but Glacier paradise amazing when in Zermatt. we took lake Brienz boat and stopped at Brienzand loved it. We thought Wengen was a great base for that area. Still to do Lucerene but going to Weggis for four nights on Sat. Transport is amazing here.

enjoy

den

Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 12, 2018 - 6:08 AM

Thank you, Den ! Its good to know that you are enjoying your stay.

We wanted to do the Glacier Paradise trip along with Gornergrat , but since Zermatt would be a day trip for us ( from Wengen/Lauterbrunnen) , it would not be feasible to accommodate both. The preference was for Gornergrat as we wanted to do the Rifflesee lake hike. Since you loved it, we would consider the lake Brienz boat ride and Brienz visit.

Even we feel , Wengen as a base would be perfect for us scenery wise. But we are still confused whether to go for Lauterbrunnen/Wilderswill as a base, since those would save us some time when taking day trips places like Zermatt.

Sumi

Lucas
Lucas
8869 posts
expert &
moderator
Jul 12, 2018 - 6:25 AM in reply to Sumi

Hi Sumi and welcome to MySwissAlps!

Wengen is the popular choice around here for a base town in the Jungfrau region, and you only have one longer day trip to Zermatt I think? So I wouldn't let that one day trip shift your plans. If anything, split the difference and stay in Lauterbrunnen - https://www.myswissalp s.com/lauterbrunnen/ho tels

I'd also try and visit Zermatt from Montreux - much quicker if you can arrange it.

Day 8 you could go to First and hike to the Bachalpsee before or after your boat ride (https://www.myswissalp s.com/activities/sceni ctrips/boat)...probably before is best. relax on the boat! https://www.myswissalp s.com/hiking/bachsee

Early October should still be nice around Switzerland. I think any order will work for you. But the Jungfrau Region might be safer to do first - hard to say with weather of course.

https://www.myswissalp s.com/besttimetovisit

A thought could be: Montreux - Lauterbrunnen - Lucerne (IE go straight down to the south and work your way back towards Zurich.

Be sure to use the Swiss railways timetable to plan out all your trips to towns and mountains and see times/durations: https://www.myswissalp s.com/timetable

Have you looked into a rail pass like the Swiss Travel Pass? https://www.myswissalp s.com/swisstravelpass

Last modified on Jul 12, 2018 - 6:27 AM by Lucas
Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 12, 2018 - 7:12 AM

Hi Lucas, thank you for the inputs, we will use the timetable and try to include your suggestions our travel plan.

Yes, we are planning take a 8-day Swiss travel pass as it will provide us with some flexibility in our plans. For the last two days, we are planning to go for Point-to-Point tickets. Hoping that some super-saver tickets will be available then! We are yet to make a calculation with the Half-fare card though and would do so before booking our pass.

- On our arrival day, flight would reach Zurich by 6PM. Would it make sense to go to Montreux on the same day and stay there to make it our first base ? I think , we would reach Montreux by 10PM.

In Montreux , we want to cover Château de Chillon and hike in the Lavaux Vineyards. Wll it be better if we visit Montreux as a day trip from Luzern or Lauterbrunnen ? I feel , this will be a long day and we cannot take the Golden pass train if we plan on visiting both those places as a daytrip.

- Will it be too much to visit Bern on from Luzern after the Mt Rigi visit and hike ?

Lucas
Lucas
8869 posts
expert &
moderator
Jul 12, 2018 - 12:36 PM in reply to Sumi

Hi Sumi,

Yes it would be a late arrival for sure. Up to you if you want to do that. Nothing wrong with your original itinerary either!

Hard to fit everything in nicely on shorter trips for sure - it means a lot of moving around. I'd probably leave your itinerary as is in the end. Personally I'd cut out either Montreux or Zermatt to make the trip a little less hectic - but that is a personal choice.

I can't say if it would be too much to do both Rigi and Bern in the same day. Play it by ear and see how you feel after Rigi.:) I don't think I'd rush off to Bern for a couple hours just for the sake of it, but I don't like to travel too much each day.

Last modified on Jul 12, 2018 - 12:37 PM by Lucas
Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 13, 2018 - 3:42 AM

Thank you so much, Lucas !

For now, we will stick to our original itinerary as we do not want to miss out seeing the Matterhorn or the Lavaux vineyards. May be we will modify it a bit and cut out one or two hikes as the days near so as to make the trip a little less hectic. Visiting Bern would be too much of a rush, so we will skip it. Or may be keep it as an alternative if we encounter any bad weather day.

Lucas
Lucas
8869 posts
expert &
moderator
Jul 13, 2018 - 8:30 AM in reply to Sumi

Yes, the key is to stay flexible whenever possible and just play it be ear and see how the day goes!

Happy Travels!

Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 14, 2018 - 2:58 PM

Hi,

Thank you Lucas !

For a day trip to Zermatt which would be better - from Wengen or from Luzern ? When I see the timetable both of these routes show a 3hr journey but the Luzern-Zermatt route shows we have to make only two train changes. So would it be a better option ?

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
5006 posts
expert
Jul 14, 2018 - 4:15 PM in reply to Sumi

Hi Sumi -

<<"For a day trip to Zermatt which would be better - from Wengen or from

Luzern ? When I see the timetable both of these routes show a 3hr

journey but the Luzern-Zermatt route shows we have to make only two

train changes. So would it be a better option ?">>

The changes will not be a problem, unless you are hauling a lot of luggage, which you would not be doing for a day trip. They are trivial. Small stations. The faster route from Luzern goes through Bern . Bern is a large and busy station, and the timetable allows a few extra minutes for that change. I checked one trip and the incoming is on platform 3, outbound platform 6. Close to each other. You'll not have a problem, but, if you are worried about it, the between-tracks pedestrian tunnel is in the middle of the station, not at the end of the tracks as at Luzern, so avoid riding in the cars at either end of the train to Bern. It will save you a minute or so in your walk between platforms.

This map will give you a feel for the locations:

map.search.ch/?pos=658560,176768&z=2

Zoom way in to zoom level 32 and the frail lines become very clear.

map.search.ch/?pos=640128,164304&z=32

The journey from Wengen to Zermatt is shorter in distance, but it has the slow legs from Wengen to Lauterbrunnen and Lauterbrunnen to Interlaken before you pick up main line rail.

Both routes converge at Spiez and go to Zermatt from there.

The journey of around 3 and 1/4 hours by either route makes use of the new "Lötschberg Basis Tunnel" - a fast tunnel under that portion of the Alps from near Spiez to Visp. That takes one hour off the higher, older rather scenic route via Kandersteg and Brig to Visp. I always choose that old route because the scenery in the "basis" tunnel lacks interest...pretty boring actually, but you can take a nap. ;-)

However, another forum member noted that the scenery at Zermatt was what they were really interested in, and felt that the one hour added was not worth it. Your choice.

Slowpoke

Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 15, 2018 - 6:31 PM in reply to Slowpoke

Hi Slowpoke ,

Thank you for the detailed description and maps on the train stations. It clears out the confusion. We finalized on Wengen to Zermatt , since the return trip take somewhat lesser time to reach Wengen.

As for the scenic route, we will either take it on Day trip to Zermatt or on Day 4 when we travel to Brig to take the Glacier Express. Both of these would be long days for sure.

We did some calculations to choose the best pass and to our surprise we find the 15 days Swiss travel pass as the most convenient option for us , although we are travelling for just 10 days (We arrive late on Day 1 and leave early on Day 12). A combination of 8 day STP and 2 day Tell pass costs almost the same (only with the advantage of Pilatus as a free trip , which is anyways difficult to cover along with Titlis and Rigi during our 2 days in Luzern). Same with a 8 day Swiss travel pass flex and 2 day saver pass which comes about the same price.

.

Lucas
Lucas
8869 posts
expert &
moderator
Jul 16, 2018 - 7:00 AM in reply to Sumi

Hi Sumi,

I'm not surprised the 15 day Swiss Travel Pass is the best option for you. Often people feel they are wasting 2-3 days if they are only in country for 12 days - but what matters is the final price point in the end! :) Of course, the STP is also very convenient!

Happy Travels!

Magicden
Magicden
21 posts
new member
Jul 16, 2018 - 7:51 AM

We bought the 15 day Swiss Travel Pass and it paid for itself in five days. It is outstanding value for money if you plan to use the rail, boat and bus system as well as cable cars.

Th Schilthorn and Mt Rigi trip alone are a great saving. We stayed in Weggis 4 nights and it was great to jump on and off the boats whenever we wanted.

Den

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
5006 posts
expert
Jul 16, 2018 - 9:13 AM in reply to Sumi

Hi Sumi-

<<"Day 5 - Take Golden Pass from Luzern to Montreux - Visit Vevey - Hike in

Lavaux vineyards (Epesses - Chexbres - Rivaz - Saint Saphorin) -

Overnight in Montreux">>

That should be quite nice in October, pretty much after the harvests. It is a good walk to stretch your legs after that train ride.

I have attached a couple of pictures taken near to Epesses in 2002 while walking in the late afternoon sun. I walked from Grandvaux station down through the vineyards to Grandvaux and then to Cully to catch the train. The vines are just starting to develop their leaves; it was very early May. The sun can be really warm....makes for good vineyards.

Sunset on October 5th will be at 7:38 PM, so you'll have nice aftenoon sun at your backs.

You did specify "easy" walks. Indeed, by most standards that is an easy walk, although you will have about a 100 meter climb to Chexbres and 100 meters back down to Rivaz. Looking at the trails, you'll probably want to take the climb at Epesses and go along the upper trail. If you do it at Rivaz, you would go up and down the same trail in both directions.

map.geo.admin.ch/?topic=ech&lang=en&bgLa yer=ch.swisstopo.pixel karte-farbe&layers=ch.bav.ha ltestellen-oev,ch.swisstopo.swiss tlm3d-wanderwege&layers_visi bility=false,true&E=25 48146.50&N=1148583.52& zoom=7

That hillside is quite steep.

The train ride from Vevey to Puidoux via Chexbres, though short, has magnificent views across the northern portion of the lake.

www.myswitzerland.com/ en-us/by-train-across-the-vineyards.html

It seems that there are some "train" rides available through the vineyards for tourists in the region. I don't know any details.

<<"The “Lavaux Panoramic” is a tourist train with tyred wheels that carries

visitors from Chexbres-Village along narrow roads through the

vineyards. On the way, travellers can learn about the characteristics of

the region as they admire the spectacular landscape. Similar trains

known as the “Lavaux Express” also run through the Lavaux vineyards from

Lutry and Cully. The winegrowers offer tourists the chance to taste

their wines in their cellars.">>

Slowpoke

Last modified on Jul 16, 2018 - 9:33 AM by Slowpoke
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Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 18, 2018 - 4:42 AM

Thank you Lucas , we felt exactly the same. We had nt considered the 15 days pass in the beginning since most of our planned travelling was for 10 days. But after calculating the cost and taking the conveniency factor into account, 15 days STP seems to be our best bet rather than wait and take risk for supersaver tickets and saver day passes.

@Magicden - Thank you ! Its really helpful in choosing the pass after having your second opinions on the 15 day Swiss Travel Pass. Weggis looks beautiful. We have planned to spend sometime in there after our Mt Rigi visit. But we feel Luzern would suit us more as a base as we have day trips planned to Titlis, Rigi and to catch Glacier express from Brig.

@Slowpoke - Even I had read somewhere that the vineyards will be beautiful during fall. Else we were considering Montreux as a day trip from Luzern initially but then changed our plans to stay in Montreux for a day. Your pictures are beautiful as always. Thank you for the efforts in posting them here.

It looks logical to take the upper trail at Epesses , climb back down at Rivaz and then proceed to Saint Saphorin. When I search , Sunset on October 5th shows to be at 7.05PM at Saint Saphorin. We plan to be there by that time and then take the train back to Montreux. We do hope the trails are well marked so we are not lost in between the vineyards :-D

Another question, during our return from Mount Titlis, we plan to get down to Engelberg using Scooter. Do we have to buy a round trip ticket to Titlis from Engelberg or one-way ticket will suffice ?

Last modified on Jul 18, 2018 - 5:36 AM by Sumi
Lucas
Lucas
8869 posts
expert &
moderator
Jul 18, 2018 - 11:09 AM in reply to Sumi

Just a one-way ticket, but you'll need to pay for the scooters, which are listed on their website for 8chf each. You start at Gerschnialp / Untertrübsee

Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 19, 2018 - 4:44 AM in reply to Lucas

Okay, but I could not find any details of how do to reach Gerschnialp / Untertrübsee from Titlis ? Are those stops for the cable car to Titlis from Engelberg ? If so, then we have to purchase a return ticket from Titlis to Gerschnialp / Untertrübsee and then take the scooter down to Engelberg ? But still I don't find a direct return ticket for that connection down to Gerschnialp / Untertrübsee in the SBB site.

Lucas
Lucas
8869 posts
expert &
moderator
Jul 19, 2018 - 2:24 PM in reply to Sumi

you can see the different lifts on Titlis on their website here: https://www.titlis.ch/ en/info/general/Timeta bles. You can take a funicular to Gerschnialp and get the scooters there.

Sumi
Sumi
10 posts
new member
Jul 19, 2018 - 3:38 PM in reply to Lucas

Thank you , Lucas !

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