Car or train for getting around Jungfrau region

Car or train for getting around Jungfrau region

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krilly1972
krilly1972
1 post
new member
Jan 6, 2018 - 2:48 PM

Hello

Im looking for some advice please. I have read through this website but need more experience from locals or past visitors

We are flying in and out of Basel on Fri 9 March and Mon 12 March. Our party includes myself and my husband, my 72 year old Mother and my 18 year old (student) son.

We were thinking of staying in Interlaken and perhaps visiting local little towns/villages nearby Lauterbrunnen, Grindelwald etc, see the sights, lakes and mountains perhaps even manage a mountain top cable car ride Piz Gloria /schilthorn etc.

How would you recommend we keep our costs down? By train or by car? Are the villages accessible by car if we experience much snow etc. Also, is there generally much snow in Interlaken itself (thinking about Mums ability to walk in snow)?

Any help and advice would be gratefully received

Thanks Helen

Lucas
Lucas
5527 posts
expert &
moderator
Jan 6, 2018 - 5:56 PM in reply to krilly1972

Hi Helen and welcome to MySwissAlps!

I think train travel is probably your best bet - indeed some villages, and the mountains of course, are only accessible by rail or cable car so buying a rail pass will be the most convenient and probably the most cost effective as well (Schilthorn for example is free if you travel on the Swiss Travel Pass).

You can't access Wengen or Mürren by car at any time so you will need to take a train/cable car to get there anyway.

For general tips about traveling on a budget in Switzerland click here.

As for snow fall I can't predict of there will be a lot of snow in Interlaken but I doubt it. Not so much that you would have major issues getting around - the Swiss are great and clearing roads and sidewalks (of course be careful for slippery sections!).

Peterli
Peterli
396 posts
top member
Jan 6, 2018 - 10:43 PM in reply to krilly1972

Hi Helen,

When I was a teenager, I covered a huge amount of the Swiss rail systems, both CFF/SBB and private. It was a great way to get all around, and of course, I didn't have a car as an alternative. Now I travel almost exclusively by car, but for what you are considering, I believe that your best bet is to travel by rail. As Lucas has mentioned, travel by car to some of the places you would like to visit is not even an option. If you know exactly where you are planning to go, including the trip from and back to Basel, you can work out whether it would be better to pay as you go or to purchase a train pass. If the two ways seem to result in approximately the same cost, I would opt for a train pass, as this will give you the freedom to do any extra trips without worrying about any additional charges.

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 7, 2018 - 2:17 AM in reply to Peterli

Bonsoir, Peterli.

<<"Now I travel almost exclusively by car,">>

Aha!

I now know whom to blame for the much reduced bus service on weekends to Mettlenalp, below the Napf. Your car my well be one of the many near the small inn, where 25 years ago there were very few, even on weekends. ;-(

www.mettlenalp.ch/

Slowpoke

Peterli
Peterli
396 posts
top member
Jan 7, 2018 - 6:42 AM

Hej Slowpoke,

I want to thank you so much for bringing this little bit of Switzerland to my attention. I have never been to the Napf (so the Alfa Romeo you saw must belong to somebody else ;) ) but after digging on various internet sites I have added it to my list of new places to visit in Switzerland. I love panoramas !

I am never pleased when I read that the availability of various forms of public transport has diminished. I do suspect that because of increasing affluence, more and more Swiss families are taking to the roads in their sedans and SUVs to explore new places and go camping, but I do hope that this will not erode the fabulous public transportation system that we are able to use. No doubt the time will come when I will once again chose this system for my movements.

By the way, I assume you have been to Affoltern im Emmental, but am wondering if you have been to the nearby Lueg with its amazing panorama. www.mountainstamp.com/ Swiss_panorama_Gallery /Lueg/Lueg_panorama_A. htm

Peterli

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 7, 2018 - 2:18 PM in reply to Peterli

Gruessech Peterli-

( since we're talking about canton Bern.)

The small Gasthof at Mettlenalp is a charming piece of old Switzerland. If you explored the web site, you note that they have a spotlessly clean Matratzanlager, but you pay extra if they have to heat it.

The restaurant is small, with a limited menu, but very clean....., a few typical old bare wood tables washed frequently. The meringues are excellent. To be expected near Kemmeriboden.

The views from the Napf are mostly of "die Eggen und die Graben" for which the area is well known. Certainly there are more striking alpine panoramas.

However, the mountain hotel on top is very popular, with a decent kitchen, and one of the national trails passes by. We always used to joke that we climbed the Napf to get their excellent Kartoffelsalat und Emmentaler Wienerli.

In addition to the views in those images attached, the ones from Lüderenalp, above Wasen are very nice. with the Schrattenflüh quite prominent. Don't have good one handy at the moment.

That movng panorama from the Lueg near Kaltacker is super! Wonderful lighting, to.

Regarding Affoltern i.E., my favorite inn for years has been converted to apartments. Landgasthof Sonne. Wonderful selection of Bordeaux, and a great kitchen. All gone. I'm hoping that they might maintain the restaurant, as happened at the Hotel Eiger in Wengen, when it became an apartment building. Herr Briggen is an excellent chef. Interestingly, originally from the Muotathal.

See attached pictures. The one taken above Sumiswald is from very close to a schoolhouse named the "Schulhaus Lueg" or something like that. It is the building to the right of Neuegg at the 819 meter mark.

map.geo.admin.ch/?topic=ech&lang=en&bgLa yer=ch.swisstopo.pixel karte-farbe&layers=ch.bav.ha ltestellen-oev,ch.swisstopo.swiss tlm3d-wanderwege&layers_visi bility=false,false&E=2 621830.00&N=1209902.50 &zoom=9

The view of the entire alpine massif is as least as good as, and may be even better, than the view from near Kaltacker, and you get Schloss Trachselwald thrown in for good measure.

The inn in Trubschachen (die Bären) has been there since about the 1400's; known for making their own cheese.

If you go into the valley northwards from Trubschachen, on the way to Mettlenalp, you pass Trub. I went up on the ridge above to get that picture.

I used to recommend the Löwen in Heimiswil....a beautiful and historic house ( no hotel) with a wonderful kitchen. It has declined, as have many Emmental inns, and I have not visited it for 8 or 10 years. It dates from the 1300's, and the NZZ even wrote an article about their Süüre M0cke, made, of course, acording to Grossmutti's old recipe.

You might find this thread interesting:

www.myswissalps.com/fo rum/topic/langnau-in-may

Slowpoke

Last modified on Jan 7, 2018 - 4:28 PM by Slowpoke
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AlanPrice
AlanPrice
176 posts
active member
Jan 7, 2018 - 11:20 PM

Hi,

Just to ad my 2 cents worth, I always take the trains in Switzerland. For someone from Australia they are a marvel and catching a train is part of the holiday. I always get excited as the train pulls out of the station as it affirms that I am really on vacation and somebody else is doing the driving and I can just pay attention to the view. Friends came back from a trip through the Jungfrau region in November and despite my advice, decided to drive. They had a wonderful time, but after talking to them and looking at their photos, I felt they had missed out on the full experience.

As far as snow goes, there is always the chance of some in the villages, but overall i'd think it unlikely. A walking stock would be a good idea if conditions aren't ideal. I use a Leki Wanderfreund that has a T-Handle and looks like a conventional walking stick rather than a ski stock. I find them more comfortable and versatile than the ski pole ones.

Hope this helps

Alan

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 7, 2018 - 11:33 PM in reply to Peterli

Gutig Abig Peterli -

I mentioned the "Löie" in Heimiswil.

Worth the detour and a meal, just to see the house.

Apparently, they are still gong strong. To quote -

"Löwenstarke."

www.loewen-heimiswil.ch/

Slowpoke

Last modified on Jan 7, 2018 - 11:34 PM by Slowpoke
Peterli
Peterli
396 posts
top member
Jan 8, 2018 - 1:27 AM in reply to Slowpoke

Hej Slowpoke,

Your third photograph, Trachselwald Panorama viewed from above Sumiswald, is amazing. You were lucky to be in the right place at the right time and to have an eye for the right photograph. Would you mind if I used it as my desktop for a while ? I'm pretty sure I read your speaking of the problem of digitizing your older photos, which are probably in the form of diapositives, like mine. I bought a converter on eBay but had mixed results. I even tried projecting my diapositives onto a blank white wall and then taking digital photos. By keeping my digital camera pretty close to the projector I was able to reduce the parralax to almost zero, but I am still far from happy with my results. I have oodles of diapositives and was wondering if you have any suggestions on how to convert them to digital images.

Peterli

AlanPrice
AlanPrice
176 posts
active member
Jan 8, 2018 - 1:31 AM in reply to Peterli

Likewise. That is a stunning Panorama!

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 1:36 AM in reply to Peterli

<<"I have oodles of diapositives and was wondering if you have any suggestions on how to convert them to digital images.">>

Get a film scanner. Hard to do these days, though. Some flatbed scanners can do the job.

The problem with 'chromes ( what we call diapositives) is dynamic range. And, if they are Kodachrome specifically , other specialized issues; automatic dust and dirt removal gets confused.

Thanks for your comments about Trachselwald panorama. 7 frames, merged with Photoshop, plus tonal manipulation with Photoshop. Many hours to build that image.

Slowpoke

Last modified on Jan 8, 2018 - 1:41 AM by Slowpoke
Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 1:40 AM in reply to Peterli

Hi Peteli -

<<"Would you mind if I used it as my desktop for a while ?">>

No problem.

Use it as is but I'll put up another one with attribution in very small print in one corner.

What is your screen size and resolution?...it might be better if I sent you a higher resolution file. Arno can mediate the e-mail addresses, I hope.

Slowpoke

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 1:51 AM in reply to AlanPrice

Hi Alan -

<<"Likewise. That is a stunning Panorama! ">>

Thanks. We liked it enough to put it on the wall, at 48 by 22 inches ( 122 by 56 mm).

Hard to find the right place to hang it. It is best seen by starting from about 4 meters away, then walking into the image.

Slowpoke

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 2:05 AM in reply to Peterli

Hi Peterli-

<<"I am never pleased when I read that the availability of various forms of public transport has diminished. I do suspect that because of increasing affluence, more and more Swiss families are taking to the roads in their sedans and SUVs to explore new places and go camping, but I do hope that this will not erode the fabulous public transportation system that we are able to use.">>

It is inevitable. The SBB constantly surveys ridership. Try to take a train around the Emmental. Each year, they take out small section of train, replacing it by bus.. Traffic declines. Survey says "Fewer riders." Then they cut back the bus service. Locals complain. No joy.

And, it is all your fault. ;-)

Slowpoke

rockoyster
rockoyster
3367 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 2:26 AM in reply to AlanPrice

Plus 1 from me.

Slowpoke you should sell that image to a jigsaw manufacturer. It would make a wonderfully challenging 5,000 piece one!

You certainly know how to drive that Olympus OM-D E-M5.

Peterli
Peterli
396 posts
top member
Jan 8, 2018 - 2:28 AM in reply to Slowpoke

Hi again,

My home computer has a huge screen but off-hand I could not say what its resolution is. I am away from home visiting my sister in the USA and when I am on the road I travel with an HP Pavilion dv6. I found a website that automatically tells the screen resolution, and it says that I am using 1366 x 768. Thank you for your kind offer. Arno is free to provide you with my email address.

I like to sleuth locations and am going to try to pinpoint the place (latitude and longitude) where you took the seven images that became the panorama.

Peter

Last modified on Jan 8, 2018 - 2:30 AM by Peterli
Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 9:36 AM in reply to rockoyster

Hi Rockoyster -

<<"Slowpoke you should sell that image to a jigsaw manufacturer. It would make a wonderfully challenging 5,000 piece one!

You certainly know how to drive that Olympus OM-D E-M5.">>

Thank you.

I'm glad that you did not say "Your camera takes nice pictures."

In fact, there are several factors involved.

1.- The camera. It has extremely accurate color reproduction, unlike at least one other famous brand. By the way, my other cameras are full frame Canon DSLRs, which also do an excellent job on color accuracy, but weigh a ton with lenses. The Oly is a very good high quality travel camera, and, due to its sensor size, ( Micro 4/3 sensor) it uses lenses that weigh perhaps 1/4th or less of the weight of a similar spec. Canon lens.

2.- The camera- it is light weight. The image was taken handheld, and weight makes a difference.

3.- The lens. It is Oly's 75mm f 1.8 from their professional grade (M-Zuiko) series . If you were to see the full size print, about 1.2 meters across you would be amazed at the level of detail. Everyone is. See attached full res crop (only edited with a trace of sharpening). Actual size of that piece of the image is about 5 by 7 cm at printed resolution. To get the exact effect, you should somehow look at it at that size. Popping it up from the Forum gives a larger (less sharp) image.

The wide aperture of that lens allowed a high shutter speed, which minimizes the effects of camera shake, permitting clear details.

4.- Adobe Photoshop. I have attached one of the 7 images that were merged to create the image. It was taken using autoexposure and aimed at the castle with center weight exposure. The Alps are washed out (overexposed) . The contrast is poor. The human eye automatically compensates, and simultaneously sees detail and tonal information in all of the range of darks and lights in the scene in actuality. To one's eyes, the Alps are clear, without loss of information in the darker parts. It is almost impossible to for even the best modern digital cameras to show all that information in an image, but it is there, buried. That attached image actually has all of the information in it, but it is not visible until an image editing program makes it visible in a printed or on-screen image.

Photoshop plus the camera's capabilities allow the full range of detail to be presented. In fact, I used Photoshop to pull up the Alps, which darkened the valley too much, and created two "exposure" versions (lighter and darker) of the panoramic image once merged. Then I laid them on top of one another, and using Photoshop tools, selectively allowed different regions to become visible...some of the Alps from the darker "exposure" and some of the valley from the lighter exposure.

5.- Adobe Photoshop. The photo merging routine is highly refined, with quite a few controls and options.

6. - Adobe Photoshop. I used it to adjust tone ( light/dark/contrast), color saturation, and apparent sharpness on individual regions of the image.

7.-An unusually clear dry day in April, 2014. And, a quite satisfying meal at the Landgasthof Bären in Sumiswald, which put me in a good mood to go up on the ridge and patiently take several tens of images, perhaps 200 all told.

8.- The Emmental itself, with such wonderful scenery. Plus,extensive wanderings in the Emmental, guiding the choice of location.

;-)

Slowpoke

Last modified on Jan 8, 2018 - 10:12 AM by Slowpoke
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Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 9:57 AM in reply to Peterli

Hi Peterli -

<<"I am away from home visiting my sister in the USA">>

Welcome to the USA. I hope that our recent coastal snowstorm and quite cold weather has not caused trouble for you. My driveway had to be plowed twice, keeping the house warm is costing a bit of money, and I'm still shovlling snow, as well as removing it from the roof with a "roof rake" before a thaw-freeze cycle turns it to ice.

<<"I like to sleuth locations and am going to try to pinpoint the place (latitude and longitude) where you took the seven images that became the panorama.">>

I attached a link to SwissTopo before in this thread, mainly to show the location of the Schulhaus Lueg.

I've attached a marked up screen grab showing the exact location, on the road up from Gammenthal, just where it enters the forest. There is an interesting artwork at the spot, to help you recognize it.

When I send the image, I'll first add an unobtrusive copyright notice, and digital watermark that will not be visible. I'll also ask you not to pass the image on. For your personal use only, please.

I never post high resolution images of any substance on the internet, so as to avoid things such as someone else doing what Rockoyster suggested.

Slowpoke

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rockoyster
rockoyster
3367 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 10:05 AM

I'm glad that you did not say "Your camera takes nice pictures."

LOL. I may be a mere colonial but I do have certain sensibilities and can recognise a craftsman when I see one. Just as a matter of interest, how much time did you spend in Photoshop to arrive at that masterpiece.

Slowpoke
Slowpoke
4486 posts
expert
Jan 8, 2018 - 10:23 AM in reply to rockoyster

Hi Rockoyster -

<<" I may be a mere colonial">>

We were colonials as well, before we had won our revolutionary war. So, i never append the word "mere" to colonial. Other adjectives apply when considering the local version of the mother tongue. ;-)

<<"Just as a matter of interest, how much time did you spend in Photoshop to arrive at that masterpiece.">>

I did it about 3 1/2 years ago, so the the memory of the pain has become blurred. ;-)

Not sure...in fact, it was fun, not painful. I'd guess an hour to select the image set, 10 minutes for the merge, and 5-6 hours for the tonal and color adjustments. Then, maybe a couple of hours doing localized fine tuning of sharpness, contrast, saturation. So, maybe 10 hours....The last part is kind of fussy, so I spread it out over a few days.

The real pain is the cost of mounting and framing...I chose to put it behind high quality glass, to help preserve the colors. I can't afford to do that often.

Slowpoke

Last modified on Jan 8, 2018 - 10:26 AM by Slowpoke

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