[Removed user]

26 May 2019 at 0:03:28 #912865

Thanks Maria! I used the viamichellin site too and I noticed they include cost for road tax. Do we have to separately pay this even with car vignette? Are they not the same?

[Arno]

26 May 2019 at 9:15:40 #912866

Hi Lizzie,

There’s no further road tax in Switzerland, apart from very remote tiny private roads and car trains (although that’s not really a tax).

[Snowman]

26 May 2019 at 9:34:31 #912867

Hi Lizzie,

Just as Arno says. In other words, when viamichelin says “Toll Road” it means “Vignette required”. The 40-franc vignette is therefore an annual pass for all toll roads (except the remote, private ones mentioned before). You are not driving a lorry/truck with international freight, right?

[Peterli]

26 May 2019 at 17:35:24 #912868

Hi Lizzie,

You said << My husband wants to drive in this passes weather permitted. I believe car vignette is very much needed in this case, am I right? Do you think weather on the 3rd week of September is nice in Switzerland too? >>

As for your first question, actually it is not the passes where the vignette is required. These high roads are not part of the Swiss system of autoroutes. The attached map shows (in red) the motorways/roads where the Vinette is required. The red dashed sections of the A16 in the Jura and the A9 in the Valais are now. complete. However, the route you have shown, coming into Switzerland from Austria and to Engelberg, and also the route you will presumably take from there to Basel, definitely will require the Vignette, so as I said about five days ago, “Don’t try to avoid it” and then, “Buy it.”

As for your second question, nothing can be certain, but usually the weather during the third week of September is delightful (and most of the foreign tourists have gone home). Once you get past the first bit of October, it is still very nice but there is always the possibility that some of the mountain passes your husband is interested in driving will be closed. The higher the pass, the sooner it might close. For example the road over the Col du Grand-Saint-Bernard closes for the season on October 15, or sooner if there are early snows. I stayed overnight at the Hospice there during the first week of October, 2013, and when I went out to my car to pick up a few items during the night, there was snow on my car. Luckily, by morning, it was all gone and I was able to drive down the very twisty but dry road to Bourg-St-Pierre and then continue down the valley to Martigny.

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[Slowpoke]

26 May 2019 at 19:42:26 #912869

Hi Lizzie –

I spent some time with the map link that you provided, and have some questions or concerns –

1.- Earlier you mentioned the Pragel Pass. It is not in that map. Which is correct?

2.-To the best of my knowledge, accessing Glärnisch will require a multi hour hike from the last road, perhaps at Käsern. I am puzzled by the grey dotted line which shows on the map from your link.

3.- Your route shows you traversing the Alps southward through the Gotthard Pass tunnel, to Airolo, followed by the climb northward to the pass, and return by the same route, down to Airolo, back to Altdorf, and onward to Engelberg.

Why do you not plant to avoid the tunnel on at least on traverse? Have you considered using the old route from Altdorf to the top, then continuing down to Airolo, then returning through the tunnel? Or, vice versa? The views inside the tunnel are not very scenic; consequently, I would tend to avoid two trips through the tunnel.

4.- Google maps shows a route taking 8 hours, with the potentially for adding a multihour climb and return at Glärnisch. Ignoring the Glärnisch puzzle, that is drive time with no allowance for meal stops or photography. I have found that driving the mountain passes is more fatiguing than driving on roads that have suitable guard rails or else no need for them. If your husband is used to such driving, that’s fine. If not, the trip may be ambitious.

Slowpoke

[Removed user]

26 May 2019 at 23:20:10 #912870

Thanks Slowpoke for following up! That’s so nice of you!

1. I dont rem mentioning Pragel Pass on my original message. But when I made a research, is this in Klontalersee?

2. I do not see gray lines though. But if this requires multi hike then we can omit this. We just basically want to have a nice leisurely drive enjoying the mountain sceneries without doing hikes since we do not have time for that.

3. THIS IS WHAT THE GOOGLE MAPS RESULTS. aND YES, DEFINITELY WE DO NOT WANT TO BE DRIVING THRough tunnels since this contradicts our main objective. thanks for pointing that out! any recom for routes through gotthard pass? my husband wants to experience driving through Gotthard. the link is basically what we want to see it in terms of scenery. images.app.goo.gl/tnbU V13cMoiXFcUc6

4. We want to experience the drive in Gotthard Pass, Klaussen Pass and Klontalersee Pass. but if it is too much perhaps we can remove Klontalersee as I can see it is only 1 way. btw, are these 3 passes do not have guard rails? i see pictures of these 3 passes in Google that have guard rails though.

THANKS ONCE AGAIN!

[Removed user]

26 May 2019 at 23:43:18 #912871

You route absolutely includes motorways so Vignette a must.

In the meantime can I ask is there a particular reason behind this itinerary (and the specific places Klontalersee, Glärnisch etc ), which is undoubtedly scenic, but convoluted?

In particular, I note that your google maps itinerary shows going south through the Gotthard tunnel, to come back up to the Gotthard Pass and terminate at the top, then reversing the whole thing which means two transits of the Gotthard Tunnel. Due to the traffic regulation in the Gotthard Tunnel, which causes tailbacks and delays, it would be simpler to use the old Gotthard Pass road form the north.

A simpler itinerary which retains pass roads, lakes and glaciers views would be:

Schwangau – Chur – Disentis – Oberalp Pass – Andermatt – Gotthard Pass – Andermatt – Wassen – Susten Pass – Meiringen then on to Brienz, which I think is a better stopping point

or the variant from Andermatt: Andermatt – Furka Pass – Grimsel Pass – Meiringen

[Slowpoke]

27 May 2019 at 0:14:29 #912872

Hi 1960man-

Thanks for reinforcing my message, posted quite a bit before you responded.

<<“In particular, I note that your google maps itinerary shows going south through the Gotthard tunnel, to come back up to the Gotthard Pass and terminate at the top, then reversing the whole thing which means two transits of the Gotthard Tunnel. Due to the traffic regulation in the Gotthard Tunnel, which causes tailbacks and delays, it would be simpler to use the old Gotthard Pass road form the north.”>>

Here is what I wrote:

<“3.- Your route shows you traversing the Alps southward through the Gotthard Pass tunnel, to Airolo, followed by the climb northward to the pass, and return by the same route, down to Airolo, back to Altdorf, and onward to Engelberg.

Why do you not plan to avoid the tunnel on at least one traverse? Have you considered using the old route from Altdorf to the top, then continuing down to Airolo, then returning through the tunnel? Or, vice versa? The views inside the tunnel are not very scenic; consequently, I would tend to avoid two trips through the tunnel.”>>

I like your alternate route, especially stopping in Brienz.

Slowpoke

[Slowpoke]

27 May 2019 at 0:22:46 #912873

<<“I dont rem mentioning Pragel Pass on my original message. But when I made a research, is this in Klontalersee?”>>

You are correct. I do not know what the Klontalersee Pass is, so I assumed that you meant the Pragel pass…from Klontalersee to the Muottatal.

I did not understand you correctly.

I am not aware of a Klontalersee Pass, per se.

Slowpoke