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Hi, We are doing the below journey on 15 June – have completed it before and believe it is the best train trip that exists in the world for us.
After our Golden Pass journey as listed below we want to spend some time in Geneva. Husband is not interested in seeing the United Nations…
I was planning to see the following when we arrive in Geneva at 17.30.
Central Railway Station>Rue du Mont-Blanc 1201+1204 (Pedestrian Zone + over bridge)>See Fountain and Clock>Place du Molard (Square & Restaurants)>Rue du Marché (Square & Shops near lake) >Old Town> St Pierre Cathedral>Place du Bourg-de-Four 24 (In heart of Old Town, Square)>Rue des Granges (Old houses & view back to park) Maison Tavel (11th Century Oldest House in Geneva)>Treille Promenade (16 C Promenade built as observation & Artillery Post – Now romantic stroll)>Bastions Park (Park & Reformation Wall, University, Opera)>Place de Neuve (One of the main squares) Optional: Ariana Park
My question please, is there a tram or bus that will take us from the Old Town area to the station, to take us back to Montreux for the night please? I have bad knees and want to walk as much as possible, but when we have finished sight seeing would like to rest my knees as much as possible.
Golden Pass Journey:
Zurich>Luzern>Interlaken>Zweisimmen>GstaadMontreux 8.04>17.30
Zurich>Luzern 8.04>8.49 45 mins IR2629
Luzern>Interlaken Ost 9.05>10.55 1.50 Hr Interlaken West
Interlaken West>Zweisimmen 13.11>14.19 1.08 Hr 22 Reg
Zweisimmen>Gstaad 14.25>14.51D3123 0.26 mins
Gstaad>Montreux 14.53>16.13 IR21231½ Hrs (8.04>16.13) 8¼ Hr Special
Montreux Plat 6>Plat 1>Geneva IR90 Ch 7 min Arrv 17.30
Geneva>Montreux 19.42/20.12/30/21.09
If there are any suggestions regarding our plans it would be appreciated.
We also plan to complete the Bermina Pass as well once we return to Zurich the next day.
Planned Trip 16 June back to Zurich
Part of Golden Pass>Bern>Zurich
Montreux>Gstaad>Zweisimmen>Bern>Geneva 9.44>17.58
Montreux>Gstaad 9.44>11.03 or 10.53>12.20 Arv Plat 1
Gstaad Plat 1>Ch @ Zweisimmen>Bern 11.23>13.20 or 12.23>14.20
Bern>Zurich 16.02>16.38 Hourly/Changes Other Times
Montreux>Bern via Gstaad+Zw’men 11.05 + 9.44>11.22 D3118
Zweisimmen>(Spiez 12.50)>Bern 12.01>13.20 3½ hours stopover
Bern>Zurich 17.02>17.58
Bern Walk Plan from Train Station
Walk out onto the Bahnhofplatz. Here you will see a magnificent glass roof which was put up to protect the tram passengers from the weather. It is really beautiful and does its job well!
Leave the Bahnhofplatz and turn left down the Spitalgasse to the Bärenplatz, crossing over to continue down the Marktgasse to the next intersection – the Kornhausplatz – this will start you on walk in the arcades of the old town of Bern . This part of town is full of shops and department stores and if you wish to picnic then you can get your supplies in the Food Hall at Globus (in the basement) which has lots of take away food and drinks. There are also a lot of “confiseries” – sweet shops – bakeries and “charcuteries” – delicatessens – where you can buy material for a great picnic.
Entering the Marktgasse the old town of Bern awaits you. This part of town was rebuilt after a large fire in 1405 and you will immediately be struck by the architecture – houses joined together with arcades in front. In fact these arcades make Bern a great place to visit on a rainy day! Note the little “gasse” which run between the houses. You will find lots of little boutiques and cafés there. IF you can, plan your visit nicely to be at the Zytglockenturm just a little further along at 11.55am. At noon the clock chimes, a cockerel crows and all sorts of cute things happen! The clock dates from the 16 th century but the tower itself is 12 h century.
From here continue on down to the Nydeggbrucke. (The roads run one into another – Spitalgasse becomes Marktgasse, in turn Kramgasse and then Gerechitkeitsgasse)
I know I am asking a lot, so if you just want to comment on my first question – tram or bus to get us back from Old Town area to Geneva Station please? I thought I had read about something once in a blog but now cannot find it.. I
realise this time does not do Geneva justice, but we are away from Australia 9 weeks and cannot extend our trip any longer.
Switzerland is the country we will be spending the most amount if time in. It is indeed a beautiful country and we share this with all our fellow travellers.
Thank you for any kind assistance you could offer.
Kind regads
Carolyn
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G’day Carolyn and Welcome to MySwissAlps,
That’s a pretty busy day you have planned on 15 June!
Google Maps will give you a pretty good idea of how to get around in Geneva. If you have a Swiss Travel Pass the local transport will be free.
Instead of doubling back over the Golden Pass route why not see some different scenery. From Montreux go Lausanne, Neuschâtel, Bern, Zurich.
Or from Montreux to Montboven, to Bulle, to Bern, to Zurich. That way you could even see a chocolate factory at Broc Fabrique or the cheese factory at Gruyères.
Or stop in Montreux on 15 June. Then on 16 June proceed to Geneva for a look around then on to Bern and back to Zurich. The fastest route from Geneva to Zurich via Bern is a touch over 4 hours.
Or just give Geneva a miss.
See attached maps.
Disclaimer: I’ve never been to Geneva but judging by the comments on this Forum it is not Top of the Pops. A lot of people fly into Geneva and immediately get a train from the airport to Montreux or elsewhere.
Hi Carolyn,
Welcome to Geneva!
You end your Old Town circuit at place de Neuve. Right there, there is a tram stop for trams 12 and 18. The 18 stops at the train ststion (“gare Cornavin”). There is a panel showing you when the next tram arrives. If it involves waiting too long (18 is not so frequent) you may board the 12 and transfer to any bus going to Gare Cornavin, or tram 14, at the next stop “Bel-Air”.
The ticket costs CHF 3.00, valid 1 hour (transfers included), must be purchased before boarding at the vending machine near the tram stop. If you have a day pass of the Swiss railways CFF, that would also be valid on the Geneva public transport TPG.
Not sure what you mean when you mention your bad knees. Walking from the station to the Old Town, starting at 17:30, in high summer, might be a bit of a challenge. The streets to the Old Town are sometimes steep, with cobble stones. So I suggest you give up at least the Ariana Park (plus, it would force your husband to see the United Nations…)
Do you plan to have dinner in the Old Town?
Many thanks Rockoyster. Yes I have heard to give Geneva a miss but I find that hard to do when so close. I wasn’t going to spend all that much time there – A few years back we did 105 mainly of Northern and mid Europe – Scandinavian countries, St Petersburg, Helsinki, Germany, Hungry, Austria, Switzerland, France, Belgium, UK & Ireland. Except for Ireland mostly on the trains, which we love.
I am not concerned about the train travel as it is just jumping on and off trains – did the Golden Pass trip a few years back and I would recommend it to anyone. We would leave most of our luggage in Zurich and just have a backpack each. We know we can check our luggage on at Zurich and pick it up in Montreux. Swiss Railways is fantastic for that. We would have lunch in Interlaken and walk between the stations as we did last time. My husband was so against walking between the two stations at Interlaken and now he tells everyone to do it.
I looked at Lausanne but there didn’t seem to be very much there. Unless there are great views from the train around there and Neuschâtel??
I realise I messed some of the times and things on return visit when I was proofreading my itinerary.
I thought, as you suggested, of doing Geneva in the morning and then onto Bern. We will do that if we are tired when we get to Montreux.
We are also doing the Bermina Pass – Zurich to Chur. We like to get out and look at towns so will take the regional trains. We will stay overnight in St Moritz and the next day go to Vareena on Lake Como via Tirano to complete the Bernina Pass.
We are staying in Vareena for two nights then going to Milano, where we will spend the afternoon and evening at Lake Lugano.
Our next bit is Milano to Nice for a night and then only Barcelona – the train hugs the coastline for those two parts all the way, except it goes inland at Monaco.
So you see we are very use to doing this.
We did another 9+ weeks doing the bottom parts of Europe including Istanbul, Greek Islands, Athens, Italy and then Nice, Barcelona, Porto, Lisbon and the Algarve.
We travel so far and due to parents being ill for so kong have had to do long trips to make up. Australians are big travellers.. guess cause we live so far away.
Again appreciate your input. We have a European Global Pass so can jump and off trains at will, unless we need to reservations. .
Dear Snowman
Many thanks for this vital information. I knew I had read about a tram, but could not find the thread again. I usually document everything I read but… thank goodness for your help.
I have had two knee replacements so am hoping this time my knees will be in better shape than on our previous trips.
Istanbul and Italy had the worst cobblestones, so I am sure I will manage. The walking I have planned is not too far, but thank you for the heads up.
I really appreciate people helping the way people like you and Rockoyster and others who take the time to help others. When we were in Istanbul a couple of years back my knees were so bad. We were walking back to our hotel and hubby thought he knew how we could get back easier… We ended up on the highway area where we had driven in from the airport and I thought there was o way I could get back to hotel… I almost cried when I saw where we came out.. I am not a crier.. Obviously I made it back. Hubby did some reconnisiance and he found a better way for the next time.
I couldn’t recall where the park so thanks for saying it was at the United Nations area. I also appreciate knowing the streets are steep – had not read that at all. Usually it would pop up in a blog somewhere. If my knees are giving me a lot of trouble I will rethink it but I am afraid I find it difficult to miss anything.
Thank you once again. I will certainly take note of the tram numbers and the information as well as the cobblestones and steepness of Geneva. I just didn’t even think of that. I don’t think we have cobblestones in Australia – our country is too new.. We are celebrating Australia Day in Australia today.
Is there anywhere you would suggest to eat in Geneva at all please?
Kind regards
Carolyn
Dear Alpenrose
Wow. I have never seen that sight. Thank you so much. I am sure I will spend the evening pouring over it.
I usually use Google Maps for most transport things. This looks so good. Thank you very much.
Greatly appreciated.
Kind regards
Carolyn
Hi Carolyn,
You are a much more seasoned traveller than me but “We are staying in Vareena for two nights then going to Milano, where we will spend the afternoon and evening at Lake Lugano” has me beat.
Hi Rockoyster
You have me worried. Why does going to Lake Lugano have you beat??
Kind regards
Carolyn
Having thought about it I guess you mean you are slipping up to Lake Lugano from Milan for the evening. Fair enough.
Carolyn,
You could go to Café Papon on your way from Maison Tavel to La Treille promenade. In June, you will enjoy the open air terrace. Bill Clinton dined at Les Armures near Maison Tavel. I haven’t been there myself, if that’s you want reserve ahead of time. Local people don’t eat fondue in summer time. Try fresh water fish such as féra or filets de perches.
Don’t get too scared by cobblestones, most (but not all) streets have sidewalks and these have modern pavement.
Bus line 36 runs through the Old Town.
And from place de Neuve, bus line 3 also goes to the train ststion. But the stop is not exactly where the two tram line stop.
Check out if the smartphone app TPG is available where you are. It will tell you eveything about the Geneva public transport system. Note that it includes “les Mouettes”, boat ines that include the Pâquis to Molard line that might be on your itinerery if you are willing to skip the flower clock (not so interesting IMMO).
Thank you – You had me worried as I bow to your expert opinion. We are going to trains it up to the cathedral in Milan, as apparently it is quite something. I think by 1 pm, at the latest, we can get the train to the lake and spend as much time as we want there.
We have purchased a first class Euro Global Pass and I believe we can hop on the train in Milan and return back to Mllan, when we feel like it.
In Australia we think nothing of travelling with our caravan and driving at least 500 km in a day, if required. We have a big country with many kilometres in-between places. Sadly, our trains are not like yours and mainly pensioners, who get train travel quite cheaply, are the only ones who use trains to travel any distance. For example the distance between the capital (Brisbane) of my state, Queensland, and Sydney in New South Wales is 961 km… Some people would drive that in a day. The trains that travel a distance are mainly goods trains.
Hi Carolyn,
I’m no expert. Just a keen amateur who lives in Tasmania. Which state, I was amazed to discover after my first visit to Switzerland last year, is actually bigger than Switzerland.
Thanks to your thread I have now learned a lot about getting around Geneva for my next Swiss trip. 😎
>> I usually use Google Maps for most transport things.
Google Maps is fantastic for finding the official names of bus and tram stops, and the route number of buses/trams that stop there – hover the mouse over the stop of interest, or tap on a hand-held device. You can then use that information to do a search using an official timetable.
Alpenrose
Dear Snowman
i don’t know what has happened, it I have replied to your email so many times and it wont’s appear? Who knows..
Thank you so much for the valuable info. So relieved about side walks with no cobblestones. I have noted all the info you gave me. We’ll be dining in Geneva, if time, but not sure we will go the Cinton route… probably too pricey for us. You have given me lots of options to return to station, thank you.
I checked out the boat option… looks good, just have to co-ordinate it all.. no problem. Cannot find the time rhe suggested route takes, thought it says 60 mins the site… not sure as different routes give the same time…
We celebrated Australia Day a day late at our home with family , as one son had to work, so not been able to do anything on this,
Thank you for all the options.. and reassurances.
I had been working on Moscow and would you believe that plan took me months.. I must post that to Trip Advisor somewhere as I think I have finally perfected it.
I will check out the TPG site, thank you, too. Google Maps doesn’t give any options for transport, for some reason. Mind you I now I all I need from posts here.
Very grateful.
Carolyn
You live in Tassie. We did a car tour of Tassie last February – wow. Always meant to take the caravan there, but time and family birthdays made it too hard.
I never knew about the Google Maps tip you gave. Wow… that is is ingenious.
Thank you.
Carolyn
Dear Alphenrose66
Just checked out the site. Thank you very much.
Carolyn
Just in case anyone is using my Geneva walk, I also did a plan using “Visit a City”. It is a free program and excellent. Many cities give you just suggested tours but many, like Geneva, you can plan your own. I tried to use it using the details I posted previously here, but it wouldn’t accept street names, so this is the route I took for our few hours in Geneva.
Train Station to Flower Clock where we can see the fountain I believe, without having to walk out to it. St Pierre Cathedral, Old Town, Place Bourg du Four, Reformation Wall then back to train station, saying it is a 16 minutes walk.
Visit a City, if the city information is available, brings up all the things you can do. If you have not used it before it is wonderful. It gives you a plan and you can reject or include each suggestion. It gives detailed information about each sight, including cost of entering say a church, as well as puts places in the right order and right day. It also tells you if the place is not accessible at the time of day or day of the week you have chosen. If I am going for 2 days I will say I am going for 4 to start with. It automatically saves everything for you. It give you an allotted time but you can change that to nothing or 5 minutes if you just want to take a picture.
You can remove items and it even allows you to include your starting point – eg accommodation or train station. If there is an item not suggested by the program, as long as you have a place and address, it will include it for you.
You can print out your planned program and it stores it for you. Make sure you login and join the program. I lost some of my previous plans and I wrote to Visit a City people and they found them and updated my cities I had planned.
Hope this helps if you have not used it before. Quite ingenious. If I do take a tour I book with them, which I guess if how they get their money. Feel it is a way of giving back from using their program.
Hi Carolyn
< …saying it is a 16 minutes walk. > Not sure what distance you want to cover in 16 minutes. Let’s say that from the Reformation Wall to the train station, a marathon runner might do it in maybe 14 minutes. With runner shoes, no luggage, and a well blazed trail. I’m suddenly not sure about your travel philosophy. See, in your place I would just stay a bit longer in Milan and forget about Geneva. The duomo in Milan is quit more impressive than the Geneva cathedral.
OK, Geneva. So here it is. Walk from train station to Flower clock 15 min (brisk walk, no window shopping, no study of a map). Look at fountain (you will have to walk 50 yards from the flower clock for a good view), make one or two selfies, 5 min. Walk to Bourg-de-Four and St-Pierre, 30 minutes. Walk to Café Papon, have dinner, 1 hour. Walk to Place Neuve, see the Reformation Wall, take a selfie there, 20 minutes. Walk back to Place Neuve, wait for bus 3, 15 minutes. Ride no 3 to train station, 15 minutes to be safe. You can save 40 minutes by buying a sandwich at the train station and eat it sitting on the longest bench in the world at La Treille.
For the boat, what I mean is the Mouettes Genevoises, line 1:
http://www.mouettesgenevoises .ch/pw/en/ligne-m1/
Board at Pâquis on the Lake Front (one shuttle every 10 minutes), look at the fountain and forget about the flower clock, get off at Molard and start your old town excursion from there.
Hi Snowman,
I meant Visit a City says it is a 16 minutes walk from the Reformation Wall to the main train station. The entire walk was to take 2 hours.
I will attempt to put in your suggestions and see how long it takes, Snowman.
Thank you once again.
Carolyn
HI Carolyn-
I have spent a fair amount of time in Geneva. On my own, with colleagues who worked there, and even one personalized tour with Snowman as a guide. On that tour, we visited the Reformation Wall.
Google maps says 18 or 19 minutes from the train station ( Cornavin) to the Reformation Wall, a distance of 1.4 to 1.5 km. You would have to walk at a steady and reasonably brisk pace to make that time. It does not pass the flower clock. From the station to the lake is modestly downhill; not steep. No cobblestones. After you cross the river on the bridge that crosses the island ( on the Rue de la Tour-de-l’Ille ) the walk to the Reformation Wall is essentially a level walk. No cobblestones, I recall.
If you want to stop and look at the flower clock, you use a different bridge, the Pont du Mont Blanc and Google Maps says 27 minutes. No stopping to look at anything.
Buses or trams from Cornavin go as far as Place de Neuve in 10 or 15 minutes, and then you have to walk for a coiuple of hundred meters.
It is a fairly level route, because much of the old town is on hill above the wall. That is the hill and steep cobblestone streets that Snowman referred to.
Slowpoke
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