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Hi Constance-
<<“We can get by with our smart phones. In general, do the high Swiss
mountains make for lots of deadspots when it comes to getting.a phone
signal?”>>
Mobile phone coverage is excellent; the dead spots are in some non-populated mountain areas:
scmplc.begasoft.ch/plc app/pages/gis/netzabde ckung.jsf?lang=de
Swisscom is the best network.
<<“I think I’ll call them directly to see if they have a available a room
with beds that don’t have footboards, since we’re both tall.”>>
I do not recall footboards when I have stayed there.
The food is slow because Frau Camps – her name is Dorly – takes her time to do it right. When there is a crowd, there can be notable waits between courses.
I note too that they are looking for help……
When I was there in May, just after they opened, they had only one set piece menu…it happened that the main course was guinea hen ( das Perlhuhn). There were only 3 tables that night. There were a few alternate first course, desserts, etc.Quality was up to the usual high standards.
That was the first time that ever happened. I always go a la carte. In the past two years, a card with more than half a dozen main courses has had a reduced set of choices, especially on nights when they were not busy.
Usually,there has been a menu called “Dorly’s Mode” which is multicourse and in which she shows off her talent for balancing and presenting complementary flavors.
Here are a couple of older links.
http://www.gaultmillau.ch/res taurants/bergsonne-18299
morningcoat.org/weggis -dorly-willy-camps-stalder-hotel-bergsonne-rigi/image-2592/
I expect this year that I shall try for a Friday night or Saturday night.
We have eaten two meals per day there a couple of times. In those days 10 or 15 years ago, a sunny day brought a lot of mid-day eaters, and the total time involve took too much time out of the day. So, no midday meals there for many years. Nice to eat on the terrace and look out over the lake, though.
Whether you order a “Menu” which is what the Swiss call an organized set of courses, or do that and change something, or order a la carte, they are very flexiible. In case you haven’t run into this before, in German-speaking Switzerland, the list of food is called die Karte ( the card) and a menu is a set series of courses. Many places have a “Tagesmenu” which is a cheap special. Quite common to get people into the restaurannts, so that they’ll order drinks. Sometimes one simply orders the ‘menu.” There may be more than one at different price points.
Often I like a particular main course, but an entree (first course, as the name actually means) not on that “menu.” They’ll mix and match.
Since those days , we were or I am usually else where at midday…hiking, visiting some place around the lake, etc. So for several years it has been only an evening meal. The wine selection is good enough to usually cause us to order a full bottle. if you don’t finish it, and you are there two nights in a row, the partially used bottle will reappear automatically at your table. That is not uncommon in Switzerland.
If you do book there, I’ll ask Arno to give you my name. They know me well, and a mention will get you a little more attention. No discount 😉
Last time I did that, the person contacted Herr Camps, but then never actually made a booking. When I showed up a couple of months later, he asked me why. ;-(
He has a good memory, but is something of a character. Excellent taste in wines.
Slowpoke
Hi Constance-
<<“We can get by with our smart phones. In general, do the high Swiss
mountains make for lots of deadspots when it comes to getting.a phone
signal?”>>
Mobile phone coverage is excellent; the dead spots are in some non-populated mountain areas:
scmplc.begasoft.ch/plc app/pages/gis/netzabde ckung.jsf?lang=de
Swisscom is the best network.
<<“I think I’ll call them directly to see if they have a available a room
with beds that don’t have footboards, since we’re both tall.”>>
I do not recall footboards when I have stayed there.
The food is slow because Frau Camps – her name is Dorly – takes her time to do it right. When there is a crowd, there can be notable waits between courses.
I note too that they are looking for help……
When I was there in May, just after they opened, they had only one set piece menu…it happened that the main course was guinea hen ( das Perlhuhn). There were only 3 tables that night. There were a few alternate first course, desserts, etc.Quality was up to the usual high standards.
That was the first time that ever happened. I always go a la carte. In the past two years, a card with more than half a dozen main courses has had a reduced set of choices, especially on nights when they were not busy.
Usually,there has been a menu called “Dorly’s Mode” which is multicourse and in which she shows off her talent for balancing and presenting complementary flavors.
Here are a couple of older links.
http://www.gaultmillau.ch/res taurants/bergsonne-18299
morningcoat.org/weggis -dorly-willy-camps-stalder-hotel-bergsonne-rigi/image-2592/
I expect this year that I shall try for a Friday night or Saturday night.
We have eaten two meals per day there a couple of times. In those days 10 or 15 years ago, a sunny day brought a lot of mid-day eaters, and the total time involve took too much time out of the day. So, no midday meals there for many years. Nice to eat on the terrace and look out over the lake, though.
Whether you order a “Menu” which is what the Swiss call an organized set of courses, or do that and change something, or order a la carte, they are very flexiible. In case you haven’t run into this before, in German-speaking Switzerland, the list of food is called die Karte ( the card) and a menu is a set series of courses. Many places have a “Tagesmenu” which is a cheap special. Quite common to get people into the restaurannts, so that they’ll order drinks. Sometimes one simply orders the ‘menu.” There may be more than one at different price points.
Often I like a particular main course, but an entree (first course, as the name actually means) not on that “menu.” They’ll mix and match.
Since those days , we were or I am usually else where at midday…hiking, visiting some place around the lake, etc. So for several years it has been only an evening meal. The wine selection is good enough to usually cause us to order a full bottle. if you don’t finish it, and you are there two nights in a row, the partially used bottle will reappear automatically at your table. That is not uncommon in Switzerland.
If you do book there, I’ll ask Arno to give you my name. They know me well, and a mention will get you a little more attention. No discount 😉
Last time I did that, the person contacted Herr Camps, but then never actually made a booking. When I showed up a couple of months later, he asked me why. ;-(
He has a good memory, but is something of a character. Excellent taste in wines.
Slowpoke
Hi Constance-
The Bergsonne –
They just sold it.
I’ll give them a try, I guess. Still not sure. Dorly’s cooking was a significant part of the value.
Slowpoke, thanks! I settled on the dates to travel, and tried to book your hotel yesterday, but no luck (and maybe its being sold is part of the explanation.). In the photos on their website I did spot some rooms where the beds had a footboard, but it doesn’t matter now anyway.
So I will be staying at the Krauterhotel Edelweiss. Ever eat there? Any recommendations for a dinner on Mt Rigi now that your favorite place is closed?
The approach to menus that you dsecribe is familiar to me from other parts of Europe — although sometimes when I have booked a half-board, what is offered to guests at a set price is considerably more restricted than ordering from the “carte”. In a few places I’ve stayed, there is an evening meal — and that’s it! That usually works out ok for us, since we really have only one food restriction: both of us react poorly to most cheese products and butter, so it can’t be a major part of the meal. In other parts of Europe we’ve rarely found it to be a problem. In this part of Europe, I’m a bit more concerned I get some choices.
I’ve been to Switzerland twice before, but quite some time ago. The first time I couldn’t afford to eat anything but supermarket yoghurt, produce and crackers; the second time, I was in areas so touristy, it just didn’t work out very well. So we hope for something worthy this time. In addition to Bellinzona, Rigi, St Gallen and Zurich, we will be going to Vevey — and hope the 3 very different regions offer plenty of variety.
Thanks again! I’m sure I’ll be back with more questions.
Back immediately with a question:
For those of you who frequently travel to Swiss mountains or lakes in the first half of September, what kind of protection do you bring against cold and rain?
<<“So I will be staying at the Krauterhotel Edelweiss. Ever eat there? Any
recommendations for a dinner on Mt Rigi now that your favorite place is
closed?”>>
I don’t know that they are closed. If the new owners are smart, they’ll try hard to get guests for this season…It still has a long way to run
I haven’t eaten anywhere else up there for many years. However, the Edelweiss looks promising. Thanks for pointing it out. I’m still organizing my schedule, so I don’t know if I’ll make it up there.
Rigi Staffelhöhe is one stop further up the rail line beyonf Kaltbad. From there there is a pleasant easy walk out out to Känzeli (or Chänzeli) where there is good view over the lake and to Luzern.
If this link does not give it to you, switch to the aerial view.
map.search.ch/?pos=678193,211062&z=51 2
It then swings back at a lower level and comes into Kaltbad , passing a niche in the rocks where a small chapel sort of hides.
Hi Constance-
Snow is unlikely. That time in September on average is drier than other moths.
I wear a waterproof windbreaker with Goretex lining, and carry or wear a fleece and a wool sweater. Rain hat…I happen top like the Seattle Sombrero from OR. The brim keep the rain off you.
http://www.rei.com/product/23 8313/outdoor-research-seattle-sombrero
Hiking boots or sturdy waterproof shoes with a grippy sole.
http://www.myswissalps.com/be sttimetovisit
Slowpoke
Thanks — but ugh… We will be coming from Italy, where it will still be quite warm. I’ll need to be very clever about black layers to avoid ending up with a heavy suitcase, and probably invest in some new shoes.
Helpful link! Thanks again. (I probably should start posting in the other forums for questions about clothes, museums, non-cheesy food, etc)
Hi Constance-
<<“We will be coming from Italy, where it will still be quite warm. I’ll
need to be very clever about black layers to avoid ending up with a
heavy suitcase, and probably invest in some new shoes.”>>
Indeed..layers work.
I have always found the temperatures in the sun, especially at high altitudes, to be shirt sleeve weather in the Jungfrau region and on the Rigi in early September.
The reason for the gear is because it is not always sunny. ;-( And, especially in the hgh Alps, but even on the Rigi, the weather can change rapidly and unpredictably).
If you don’t hike, you don’t need sturdy footwear.
When you think about weather, consider the sun exposure and the altitude. Altitude is critical… Not only colder, but less predictable. Don’t rely on general weather forecasts. There are microclimates, and even a trace of rain during the day shows up in the forecast. Vevey will be quite warm (sun), as will Weggis.(sun). Skt. Gallen is at low altitude and will be comfortable.
Slowpoke
Thanks. You said that you wear a fleece. Is it more than a vest? I am thinking of packing a fleece vest, plus a long-sleeved waterproof jacket.
I don’t think we will have time to hike!
At that time of year a fleece vest and waterproof jacket should be more than fine i think – good idea!
Ok, thanks. I will be in a good position to see Swiss weather forecasts while I am packing my bags for the trip. I will definitely pack rain gear no matter what forecasts I see, but I hope to stick with lighter long-sleeve sweaters and layer them if needed rather than pack bulky stuff.
Here’s some questions about Day 3 of my trip:
My plan is to leave Mt Rigi after breakfast, descend to Arth-Goldau, take the train to St Gallen to see the library and eat lunch, and then continue on to Friedrichschafen, on the German side of the Bodensee. I want to cross the lake around sunset (hoping for a nice day!)
How do I get from my hotel on Mt Rigi to the Arth-Goldau train station? How long will it take from the time I leave the hotel?
There is an 11.14 train from Arth-Goldau that arrives in St Gallen at 1pm. Since I want to leave St Gallen by 16.00, do I have time to store my bags, see the library and eat lunch, and retrieve my bags in time to catch a 16.00h train? Or do I really need to catch an earlier train from Arth Goldau (10.14) to keep this day from getting hectic?
I’ve got two choices for getting across the lake by dinnertime: If I get off the train in Rohrschach, I can take a slow boat (2 hours) to my hotel. If I change trains and go to Romanshorn, I can take a quick ferry. Any advice about which would be nicer? I don’t like changing trains when I’m hauling luggage, but I am a little concerned that even if it’s a nice day, a 2 hour boat ride after 5pm will be quite chilly on the lake in September. But would the slower boat be noticeably more scenic, or is a seat inside the boat just as nice as one outside?
Lastly (!): Regarding stowing my bags in St Gallen, some information I’ve seen online says I can stow my bags at the train station, others say the tourist office. (I’ve seen some that say the library itself will hold them for free, but I don’t want to carry my bags into a restaurant for lunch.) I don’t care about money. I care most about not encountering lines or glitches in stowing or retrieving the bags. Any advice most welcome!
Thanks for all your thoughts!
Hi Constance.
I’ll answer the first one-
The train up to Rigi Kulm goes past Staffellhöhe , most likely, once per hour. Shortly after it arrives at Rigi Kulm, it returns toward Vitznau. At approximately the same time the other train, the blue one, departs for Arth Goldau. Use the time table for details.
<<“There is an 11.14 train from Arth-Goldau that arrives in St Gallen at 1pm”>>
Your stuck with that 1114. G et the first train up from Rigi-Staffelhöhe at 0937, and the train down to A-G at 1004, arriving at 1050. No way to make an earlier one.
Luggage at St. Gall-
There is a left luggage office. It opens early in the AM and closes in the evening with that timing dependent on the day of the week/weekend.
There may be lockers….common at larger stations…but the SBB web site is not forthcoming on that point, so I’d not count on it.
3 hours is enough to see the library, but be aware that there are only guided tours. It takes something less than an hour, if I recall correctly.
Lunch could fit. Weinstube zum Baümli is nearby, but all timings would have to work out perfectly. You cann surely grab a bite of some sort at the station. Station is a 10 minute walk from the Abbey.
http://www.myswissalps.com/fo rum/topic/st-gall-aka-sankt-gallen-and-good-bratwurst
Across the lake – Either boat will work, it won’t be too cold, and you can sit inside. I’d take the one from Romanshorn, or whichever allows more time in St. Gall. And, maybe plan a late dinner ( if possible) to get more time. Food on the boats is tolerable.. The ride is not scenic, either way. There will be food on the boat
Slowpoke
Thank you. If the ride across the lake is not scenic at sunset, then I am going to simplify our lives and stay on the Swiss side of the lake so we can have a more relaxed visit to St Gallen. We are staying on the lake for 3 nights, and we will surely be using the boats to visit other parts of the lake during our stay, so that will be enough.
Is the restaurant you mention in St Gallen the kind of place that if we walk in with duffel bags they will be ok with that, or do we need to go to the library, stow our bags (and reserve a tour?) and then go back to the restaurant, have some lunch, and do the library tour after lunch?
I am aiming for a 5pm train out of St Gallen, which should get us to a Swiss lakeside town around 6.30pm or earlier.
What are the hours when restaurant kitchens are open for lunch and dinner in Switzerland?
Thanks again for the wealth of info! Very much appreciate!
Hi Constance –
<<“Is the restaurant you mention in St Gallen the kind of place that if we walk in with duffel bags they will be ok with that, or do we need to go to the library, stow our bags (and reserve a tour?) and then go back to the. restaurant, have some lunch, and do the library tour after lunch? “>>
No problem with the bags. Restaurant is on the first floor (European) ( 2nd floor USA) and there is a lot of space to stash a couple of bags. However, if you are going out again, I’d leave the bags at the station and get them when you head out.
<<“I am aiming for a 5pm train out of St Gallen, which should get us to a Swiss lakeside town around 6.30pm or earlier.”>>
Lots of nice places all along the lake I always use the Frohsinn in Steckborn. Mostly because a Swiss acquaintance took us there once, and we liked it. Good kitchen, nice setting, the owners (the Labharts) are nice. Not special like the Bergsonne, but good.
<<“What are the hours when restaurant kitchens are open for lunch and dinner in Switzerland? “>>
Watch for signs or check their websites. Places with a real kitchen tend to cook from around noon or a bit earlier until 2 PM, then reopen at 6pm +/- till fairly late. 10 PM is not uncommon for a good restaurant or even later. Some will have an indication “Warm food all day.”
Some have a small menu or cold menu from 2 pm to 6PM. All sorts of variations on those themes.
<<“Thanks again for the wealth of info! Very much appreciate!”>>
Glad to help. I like the Ostschweiz near “The Bode.”
Also in the Bündner Herrschaft (Heidi Country) where there are some excellent vineyards. For example, at Maienfeld.
Slowpoke
<<“Slowpoke, thanks! I settled on the dates to travel, and tried to book
your hotel yesterday, but no luck (and maybe its being sold is part of
the explanation.). In the photos on their website I did spot some rooms
where the beds had a footboard, but it doesn’t matter now anyway.”>>
I got a delayed response from Herr Camps., with ambiguity about weekdays. He reminded me that Friday nights are the best bet. I’m booking Friday night the 7th of September. I guess that the Camps-Stalders are still running it.
I’m going for sentimental reasons; expecting good things but not the bountiful selections of the past. Quality will be high, of course.
Any comments after your visit up the hill from there will be welcome.
Slowpoke
Ok. I’ll try to track down firm information on whether the St Gallen train station has luggage storage.
My husband insists on having the option of air conditioning wherever we go, so I am sticking with our reservation in Friedrichschafen, since I was unable to locate anything else on the Swiss side of the lake. There are boats that traverse the lake as late 7pm, so I won’t need to rush St Gallen.
Our hotel on Mt Rigi is not at Rigi Kulm, but appears to have beautiful views. I assume the walk up from the hotel to the Kulm is something a toddler could do, but is the view from the Kulm iconic or immeasurably better? If we are enjoying the view from the hotel, should we just stay put and savor it?
I will most certainly tell you and anybody else who will listen all about our trip once we do it!
Thanks again for your help.
There are lockers at St. Gallen.
The SBB site shows station information:
https://www.sbb.ch/en/ station-services/railway-stations/st-gallen-station.html
Both lockers and left luggage office.
Slowpoke
thanks to you both! I must have misunderstood earlier about whether the SBB train station info online was ambiguous.
Any opinions about whether the view from Rigi Kulm is the real reason to go to Mt Rigi, and accept no substitutes? I ask because some years ago I visited the Amalfi coast in Italy, and made the mistake of flitting from one spot to another to see guidebook recommended views — all spectacular indeed — but ended up thinking it was nicer and more in the spirit of the area just to settle in with a cool drink and enjoy one. On the other hand, I do think there are some places where one really should go look at a view from a particular spot, no regrets.
I just have no clear picture of whether they path from Rigi Kaltbad to the kulm is a stroll or a real climb.
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